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From: rhendel@mcs.drexel.edu (Russell Hendel) Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 14:14:57 -0500 Subject: Serious Riddles Anybody? Over the past few months there have been several postings about trup. Some of these have been in the form of "one line riddles"..."Does anyone know a verse where..." These one liners seem to contrast with the heavier MJ topics, while still stimulating minor research into sacred sources. It has occured to me that we can use these one liners for SERIOUS research while STILL maintaining their light stimulating nature. Let me give two examples. I am curious whether other MJers are interested in such an undertaking. If so I have other examples. I am currently learning Mordechai Breuers 1st edition of his book on Trup. While reviewing the book my Chavruthah, Mosheh Feldman, and myself have discovered or conjectured several simple rules for which we don't have counter examples but don't have complete proofs. I give two recent examples: 1) It is well known that trup are either SEPARATIVE/DISJUNCTIVE (zarkah, segol, garmay, revii, pashtah, zakef, tipchah, ethnachtah, pazer, telishah gedola, geresh, tevir, siluk) or JOINING/CONJUNCTIVE (munach, mapach, kadmah, merchah, telisha ketanah, dargah). Sometimes there is a vertical line (Pasayk) after a JOINING trup. For example: G-d | will reign forever(Ex 15:18).They say that the vertical line indicates a pause and that this is done out of respect for G-ds name. Moshe and I (both Baalay Keriah) think this is ALWAYS true (instead of MOST of the time). We found only one counterexample which we can explain. So the question to MJ is: Find the one example where: G-ds name occurs on a JOINING trup(Mesharath) where there is NO pasayk(vertical line) afterwards. 2) Moshe and I similarly conjectured that there are NO examples where: 2 or more MUNACHS occur before a PAZER and there is no PASAYK. Is this true? Russell Hendel; Ph.d ASA; rhendel @ mcs drexel edu